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Author Topic: HELP! p0171, 174, 300, 336  (Read 9967 times)
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msvance
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« on: 06/18/08 04:15 PM »

Details - 2004 2500 AV ~92,000 miles and 100K gmpp warranty

I need help with your thoughts on this problem and how to deal with the dealership.  Sorry in advanced for the length of this.....

over the weekend, I got ~ 5 miles from the house after a week vacation and i heard a clunking sound near the transmission/torque converter and lost engine power unitl it finally stalled out.  During this time the check engine light came on and stayed on and the info center started flashing oil change reset and eventually the battery light up as well.  I let it cool off and was able to start it up but again under severely reduced power.  At times it would go full speed as if it had power and during those times i would gun it and take advantage of it then other times it would die completely so i would throw it in neutral and start it up again.  sometimes that worked sometimes it would stall and i could let cool and repeat again.

I monitored the gas mileage constantly during my trip and i averaged my normal 13.1 mpg (not too bad for the 8.1).  during this time it reduced to 1-3 mpg.  I was finally able to limp in to my drive and i called a tow truck through gmpp warranty.  I towed it to the dealer on Sunday and here is where the real issues begin.

To start the codes i eventually got from the dealer were p0171, 174, 300, 336 

However, here are the events from the info i now have.  when i dropped it off basically they got the codes.  thankfully they did this first.  Then they updated the pcm with the new updates and now all of the codes are gone and are not repeating.  The dealer is telling me that there is no more they can do and that they took the appropriate first step per their procedures although everything i have found about the codes above say nothing about doing this.  They also said their method of troubleshoot was to start with the first numeric code, code p0171/174; however what i find interesting is that DTC for p0171/174 clearly states - If any DTCs other than P0171 or P0174 are set, refer to those DTCs before continuing
   

Also, it may or may not be relevant, but last week i was on vacation and the transfer case went out - don't have the TSB with me but something about a bearing problem causing a hole in the case.  Anyhow, It was replaced with a new case under the warranty.  During the repair they broke one of the bolts in the transmission mount and couldn't get a new mount before i had to come back home (~5 hr trip) so they bolted it back up and said it should be fine.  I checked it out when i got home and the transmission didn't look to have shifted or anything.  Also, during this visit, they also performed the fuel rail recall.   

Below are the most relevant items i could find.  Also, the p0336 makes wonder about the cps.  Thoughts/input?  Thanks!





1.  97-05 Vehicles with 4.8 5.3 5.7 and 6.0 Gen III V8 Engines and Misfires on One Bank - kw CEL diagnostics driveability DTC P0171 P0172 P0174 P0175 P0300 P0301 P0302 P0303 P0304 P0305 P0306 P0307 P0308 #PIP3056 - (Jul 12, 2004)

Condition/Concern:

Check Engine Light with a P0300 due to 2 - 4 cylinders misfiring on the same bank of the engine. DTCs P0171, P0172, P0174 or P0175 may also set for the misfiring bank.

Recommendation/Instructions:

If the published misfire diagnostic does not isolate the cause, perform the following suggestions as necessary:

   1. Perform a fuel injector balance test for all 8 cylinders. If a fuel injector concern exists, it is possible to misfuel an entire bank of the engine, causing multiple cylinders on the same bank to misfire even though the root cause is a single fuel injector.
   2. Inspect O2 sensor connections on the misfiring bank for corrosion or water intrusion. If water intrusion is found on the right bank, it may be due to the AC Evaporator Condensation dripping onto the O2 sensor harness. If this condition is found, reposition and shield the harness to prevent a repeat concern and repair the connections.
   3. Check for excessive exhaust backpressure using the restricted exhaust diagnosis from SI.
   4. Swap the Position 1 O2 sensors side to side to see if the misfires move to the other bank of the engine. If so, replace the O2 sensor.

Please follow this diagnosis process thoroughly and complete each step. If the condition exhibited is resolved without completing every step, the remaining steps do not need to be performed. If these steps do not resolve the condition, please contact GM TAC for further diagnostic assistance.

Models:

(00 - 05 Cadillac Escalade - C6 and K6) and (02 - 05 Chevrolet Avalanche - C1, C2 K1 and K2) and (99 - 05 Chevrolet Silverado - C1, C2 K1 and K2) and (00 - 05 Chevrolet Suburban - C1, C2, K1 and K2) and (00 - 05 Chevrolet Tahoe - C1 and K1) and (99 - 05 GMC Sierra C1, C2 K1 and K2) and (00 - 05 GMC Yukon - C1, C2, K1 and K2) and (03 - 05 Chevrolet Express G1, G2, G3, H1, H2 ) and (03 - 05 GMC Savana G1, G2, G3, H1, H2 ) and (04 - 05 Buick Rainier S1, T1 ) and (03 - 05 Chevrolet Trail Blazer EXT S1, T1 ) and (03 - 05 GMC Envoy XL XUV S1, T1 ) and (03 - 05 Hummer H2) and (04 - 05 Cadillac CTS-V DB) and (98 - 02 Chevrolet Camaro FB) and (97 - 04 Chevrolet Corvette YB) and (98 - 02 Pontiac Firebird FB) and (04 - 05 Pontiac GTO VB)

Document ID# 1538353
2004 Chevrolet Avalanche

1.  04 Full Size Trucks and Utilities with VIN G , N , T, V and U Engines May Have a High Altitude, High Ambient Temperature Stall - kw L18 LM7 LQ4 LQ9 LR4 crank DTC fuel hard Hesitate idle #PIP3022A - (Jul 19, 2004)

The following diagnosis might be helpful if the vehicle exhibits the symptom described in the PI.

Condition/Concern:

Some 2004 Full Size Trucks and Utilities with VIN G, N, T, V and U engines that were built prior to May 1st, 2004, may stall while driving. Typically, this will occur when the altitude exceeds approximently 5,000 feet above sea level with an ambient temperature of 80 degrees F or greater. The vehicle may set DTCs P0171 and P0174 and exhibit a crank no start, hard start, lack of power or rough running concern until the vehicle cools down.

Recommendation/Instructions:

This PI does not apply to vehicles with the L59 (Vin Z) 5.3L engine. Monitor the fuel pressure during the concern. If this PI applies, the fuel pressure will be lower than specification during the concern. If the fuel pressure is low, perform the SI fuel system diagnosis during the concern. If the SI diagnostics isolate a fuel pump module concern, there is an updated fuel pump module available to address this concern. Specific part numbers may be assigned to these updated fuel pump modules in the future. For right now, if the current part number from the parts catalog has a date code of 0834 or newer, it is the updated fuel pump module and should be installed. It may be necessary to open a SPAC case to obtain one of these fuel pump modules.

Note: The Fuel Pump Module Date Code will be on top of the fuel pump module, just below the bar code and production part number. The date code will be a 4 digit number with the first 3 digits being the day of the year and the 4th digit being the year. So a date code of 0834 would translate to the 83rd day of 2004.

Please follow this diagnosis process thoroughly and complete each step. If the condition exhibited is resolved without completing every step, the remaining steps do not need to be performed. If these steps do not resolve the condition, please contact GM TAC for further diagnostic assistance.

Models:

(04 Chevrolet Silverado C1, C2, C3, K1, K2 and K3 ) and (04 Chevrolet Suburban C1, C2, C3, K1, K2 and K3) and (04 Chevrolet Tahoe C1 and K1) and (04 Chevrolet Avalanche C1, C2, K1 and K2) and (04 GMC Yukon C1, C2, C3, K1, K2 and K3 ) and (04 GMC Sierra C1, C2, C3, K1, K2 and K3) and ( 04 Cadillac EXT C6 and K6) and ( 04 Cadillac Escalade C6 and K6) and ( 04 Hummer H2)

----------------------------------------

So, unless it was built after the above date, they should honor this bulletin.
After, well, they may have a "policy" in place where they need the DTC.

Document ID# 1565073
2002 Chevrolet Avalanche
   
2.  99-03 GEN III Engine Misfire at Idle Cold and Possible P0171 and/or P0174 -kw 4.8 5.3 6.0 LR4 LM4 LM7 LQ4 crack air hesitate intermittent internal intake leak lean miss power rough surge vacuum P0300 #PIP3232 - (Nov 15, 2004)

The following diagnosis might be helpful if the vehicle exhibits the symptom described in the PI.
Condition/Concern:

99 through 03 GEN III truck engines may experience any of the following:

   1. A cold rough idle that diminishes as the engine warms up.
   2. Possible DTCs P0171, P0174, or P0300.
   3. Random misfires at idle.

Recommendation/Instructions:

Check for leaking intake manifold seals around the intake ports. The intake gasket seals may be leaking around the intake ports, causing a lean condition. Many times they will leak around the bottom side of the port, making it a challenge to detect the vacuum leak. The technician may also note lower than normal MAF readings if the seals are leaking around the ports. If leaking intake gasket seals are found, they should be replaced. The intake plenum should also be checked for warpage that may cause an uneven clamping pressure of the seal. If the plenum is found to be warped, it will need to be replaced with new seals. Intake Manifold Cylinder Head Deck Flatness specifications are located in SI.

Please follow this diagnosis process thoroughly and complete each step. If the condition exhibited is resolved without completing every step, the remaining steps do not need to be performed. If these steps do not resolve the condition, please contact GM TAC for further diagnostic assistance.

Models:

(99 00 01 02 03 C1 C2 C3 K1 K2 K3 LR4 LM4 LM7 LQ4 LQ9 Chevrolet Silverado Tahoe Suburban Avalanche Express Trailblazer ) and (99 00 01 02 03 C1 C2 C3 K1 K2 K3 LR4 LM4 LM7 LQ4 LQ9 GMC Sierra Savana Yukon Denalli Envoy) and (02 03 K6 K7 K8 Cadillac Escalade) and (03 Hummer N2)



3.  A damaged crankshaft reluctor wheel

A damaged crankshaft reluctor wheel can result in different symptoms depending on the severity and location of the damage.

    * Systems with electronic communications, DIS or coil per cylinder, and SEVERE reluctor ring damage may exhibit periodic loss of crankshaft position, stop delivering a signal, and then re-sync the crankshaft position.
    * Systems with electronic communication, DIS or coil per cylinder, and SLIGHT reluctor ring damage may exhibit no loss of crankshaft position and no misfire may occur. However, a P0300 DTC may be set.
    * Systems with mechanical communications, high voltage switch, and SEVERE reluctor ring damage may cause additional pulses and effect fuel and spark delivery to the point of generating a P0300 DTC or P0336.

4.  DTC P0171 or P0174
Circuit Description (more blah)
The powertrain control module (PCM) controls the air/fuel metering system in order to provide the best possible combination of driveability, fuel economy, and emission control. Fuel delivery is controlled differently during Open and Closed Loop. During Open Loop, the PCM determines fuel delivery based on sensor signals without oxygen sensor (O2S) input. During Closed Loop, the O2S inputs are added and used by the PCM to calculate short and long term fuel trim fuel delivery adjustments. If the O2S indicate a lean condition, fuel trim values will be above 0 percent. If the O2S indicate a rich condition, fuel trim values will be below 0 percent. Short term fuel trim values change rapidly in response to the heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) voltage signals. Long term fuel trim makes coarse adjustments in order to maintain an air/fuel ratio of 14.7:1. If the PCM detects an excessively lean condition, DTC P0171 or P0174 sets.
Important
If any DTCs other than P0171 or P0174 are set, refer to those DTCs before continuing

5.  DTC P0171 or P0174

Circuit Description
The powertrain control module (PCM) controls the air/fuel metering system in order to provide the best possible combination of driveability, fuel economy and emission control. Fuel delivery is controlled differently during Open and Closed Loop. During Open Loop the PCM determines fuel delivery based on sensor signals, without oxygen sensor input. During Closed Loop the PCM adds oxygen sensor inputs to calculate Short and Long Term fuel trim (fuel delivery adjustments). If the oxygen sensors indicate a lean condition, fuel trim values will be above 0 percent . If the oxygen sensors (O2S) indicate a rich condition, fuel trim values will be below 0 percent. Short Term fuel trim values change rapidly in response to the heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) voltage signals. Long Term fuel trim makes coarse adjustments in order to maintain an air/fuel ratio of 14.7:1. If the PCM detects an excessively lean condition, this diagnostic trouble code (DTC) will set.

Conditions for Running the DTC
   DTCs P0101, P0102, P0103, P0107, P0108, P0121, P0122, P0123, P0130, P0131, P0132, P0133, P0134, P0135, P0137, P0138, P0140, P0141, P0201, P0202, P0203, P0204, P0205, P0206 P0300, P0401, P0403, P0404, P0404, P0405, P0410, P0440, P0442, P0446, P0506, P0507, P1404, or P1441 are not set.
   The engine coolant temperature (ECT) is between 20-110C (68-230F).
   The intake air temperature (IAT) is between 18-70C (64-158F).
   The manifold absolute pressure (MAP) is between 15-105 kPa (2.1-15.2 psi).
   The vehicle speed is less than 132 km/h (82 mph).
   The engine speed is between 600-4,000 RPM.
   The barometric pressure (BARO) is more than 70 kPa (10.1 psi).
   The mass airflow (MAF) is between 5-150 g/s.
   The fuel level is more than 10 percent.

Conditions for Setting the DTC
   The average Long Term fuel trim value is above 20 percent.
   All of the above conditions are present for 6 seconds.

Action Taken When the DTC Sets
   The control module illuminates the malfunction indicator lamp (MIL) on the second consecutive ignition cycle that the diagnostic runs and fails.
   The control module records the operating conditions at the time the diagnostic fails. The first time the diagnostic fails, the control module stores this information in the Failure Records. If the diagnostic reports a failure on the second consecutive ignition cycle, the control module records the operating conditions at the time of the failure. The control module writes the operating conditions to the Freeze Frame and updates the Failure Records.

Conditions for Clearing the MIL/DTC
   The control module turns OFF the malfunction indicator lamp (MIL) after 3 consecutive ignition cycles that the diagnostic runs and does not fail.
   A current DTC, Last Test Failed, clears when the diagnostic runs and passes.
   A history DTC clears after 40 consecutive warm-up cycles, if no failures are reported by this or any other emission related diagnostic.
   Clear the MIL and the DTC with a scan tool.

Diagnostic Aids
   The system will go lean if an injector is not suppling enough fuel.
   A lean condition could be present during high fuel demand due to a fuel pump that does not pump enough fuel.
   Using a scan tool, review the Failure Records. If an intermittent condition is suspected, refer to Intermittent Conditions .

Test Description
The numbers below refer to the step numbers on the diagnostic table.
5.   If conditions were not corrected, refer to Fuel System Diagnostics for a possible fuel problem.
6.   If conditions were not corrected, a worn cam, worn intake or exhaust valves, or other the engine mechanical failures may be at fault.
Step   Action   Values   Yes   No
1   Did you perform the Diagnostic System Check-Engine Controls?   --   Go to Step 2
Go to Diagnostic System Check - Engine Controls

2   Important
If any DTCs are set, other than P0171, refer to those DTCs before continuing.
1.   Install the scan tool.
2.   Start and idle the engine at normal operating temperature in Closed Loop.
3.   Record the Long Term fuel trim data.
4.   Turn OFF the engine.
5.   Turn ON the ignition, with the engine OFF.
6.   Review the Freeze Frame and Failure Records, and record displayed data for this DTC.
Does the scan tool indicate that the Long Term fuel trim is greater than the specified value?   23%   Go to Step 3
Go to Diagnostic Aids
3   1.   Operate engine at idle.
2.   Using the scan tool observe the HO2S parameters.
Does the scan tool indicate that the values are within the specified range and fluctuating?   200-800 mV   Go to Step 4
Go to Step 5

4   1.   Turn OFF engine.
2.   Visually and physically inspect the following items:
o   Vacuum hoses for splits, kinks, and proper connections--Refer to Emission Hose Routing Diagram .
o   Ensure that the vehicle has sufficient fuel in tank. If fuel pressure is too low this DTC may set--Refer to Fuel System Diagnosis .
o   Fuel contamination--Refer to Alcohol/Contaminants-in-Fuel Diagnosis .
Did you find and correct the condition?   --   Go to Step 7
Go to Step 6

5
1.   Turn OFF engine.
2.   Check the HO2S for proper installation.
3.   Check to ensure electrical connectors and wires are secured and not contacting the exhaust system.
4.   Check for a short between the signal circuit and the low reference circuit.
Did you find and correct the condition?   --   Go to Step 7
Go to Fuel System Diagnosis

6
1.   Operate the engine at idle.
2.   Check for missing, loose, or leaking exhaust components, forward of the HO2S.
3.   Check for vacuum leaks at the intake manifold, throttle body and injector O-rings.
4.   Check the air induction system and air intake ducts for leaks.
5.   Check the secondary air injection (AIR) system for leaks, improper air delivery, shut off valve not closing.
6.   Check crankcase ventilation system for leaks--Refer to Crankcase Ventilation System Inspection/Diagnosis .
Did you find and correct the condition?   --   Go to Step 7
Go to Symptoms - Engine Mechanical

7   Important
After repairs, use scan tool Fuel Trim Reset function in order to reset the Long Term Fuel.
1.   Use the scan tool in order to clear the DTCs.
2.   Turn OFF the ignition for 30 seconds.
3.   Start the engine.
4.   Operate the vehicle within the Conditions for Running the DTC as specified in the supporting text.
Does the DTC run and pass?   --   Go to Step 8
Go to Step 2

8   With a scan tool, observe the stored information, Capture Info.
Does the scan tool display any DTCs that you have not diagnosed?   --   Go to Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) List
System OK


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'04 2500 Avalanche
37x12.5 Nitto Trail Grappler on 20x9 Ballistic Jester

5" Lift (3" BL / 2" Keys & Block)
Custom Fender clearance Kit (Sawzall/Grinder/Hammer)
2.5" rear wheel spacers
Cognito Pitman/Idler Arm Brackets
Rough Country Tie Rod sleeves
Custom rock rails
180 thermostat
new spark plugs re-gapped
Red Bowtie
Red Grill Accent
Paint match front Grille cross member
Refinish restorer on plastic
Infinity Basslink Sub
IPod Interface
MS03 2500
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« Reply #1 on: 06/18/08 04:19 PM »

I guessing your catalytic converters are bad. Or the Oxygen sensors
« Last Edit: 06/18/08 04:22 PM by MichiganSilver03 » Logged

2003 2500
msvance
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« Reply #2 on: 06/18/08 04:48 PM »

forgot to add that service air bag light started coming on off and on about a month back before any of this.........
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'04 2500 Avalanche
37x12.5 Nitto Trail Grappler on 20x9 Ballistic Jester

5" Lift (3" BL / 2" Keys & Block)
Custom Fender clearance Kit (Sawzall/Grinder/Hammer)
2.5" rear wheel spacers
Cognito Pitman/Idler Arm Brackets
Rough Country Tie Rod sleeves
Custom rock rails
180 thermostat
new spark plugs re-gapped
Red Bowtie
Red Grill Accent
Paint match front Grille cross member
Refinish restorer on plastic
Infinity Basslink Sub
IPod Interface
WILDFIRE
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« Reply #3 on: 06/19/08 03:11 AM »

I guessing your catalytic converters are bad. Or the Oxygen sensors
that would be my guess as well
forgot to add that service air bag light started coming on off and on about a month back before any of this.........
there's a connector by the seat that usually causes this
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sittin by the phone, waitin for the lord to send my calling
Question~ What are you doing in my house? Answer~ Bleeding out
msvance
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« Reply #4 on: 06/19/08 04:50 AM »

Any advice on how to deal with the dealership?  They told me their first step in troubleshooting per their documentation was to perform the pcm update which then cleared the codes and now they can't/don't want to do anything else.  I am going to talk to the guy face-to-face this afternoon, and have him walk me through their troubleshooting logic but right now i'm stuck.

do you think updating the pcm was actually the right first step?  I can't find this as a troubleshooting recommendation anywhere and is only something that is optional to do from what i can find.  does anyone have more details about the pcm upgrade - what it is for, why, etc.?

thanks for the feedback so far. 
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'04 2500 Avalanche
37x12.5 Nitto Trail Grappler on 20x9 Ballistic Jester

5" Lift (3" BL / 2" Keys & Block)
Custom Fender clearance Kit (Sawzall/Grinder/Hammer)
2.5" rear wheel spacers
Cognito Pitman/Idler Arm Brackets
Rough Country Tie Rod sleeves
Custom rock rails
180 thermostat
new spark plugs re-gapped
Red Bowtie
Red Grill Accent
Paint match front Grille cross member
Refinish restorer on plastic
Infinity Basslink Sub
IPod Interface
WILDFIRE
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« Reply #5 on: 06/19/08 04:58 AM »

the pcm upgrade is just flashing in the latest software
Have you accelerated hard up a on ramp, driven at freeway speeds since?
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sittin by the phone, waitin for the lord to send my calling
Question~ What are you doing in my house? Answer~ Bleeding out
msvance
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« Reply #6 on: 06/19/08 07:37 AM »

no they still have it waiting on the tranny mount that is broke to come in.  they said it is running fine.  That would normally be good news but it broke down for a reason now they aren't troubleshooting it and i only have 8k miles left on the warranty..... 
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'04 2500 Avalanche
37x12.5 Nitto Trail Grappler on 20x9 Ballistic Jester

5" Lift (3" BL / 2" Keys & Block)
Custom Fender clearance Kit (Sawzall/Grinder/Hammer)
2.5" rear wheel spacers
Cognito Pitman/Idler Arm Brackets
Rough Country Tie Rod sleeves
Custom rock rails
180 thermostat
new spark plugs re-gapped
Red Bowtie
Red Grill Accent
Paint match front Grille cross member
Refinish restorer on plastic
Infinity Basslink Sub
IPod Interface
WILDFIRE
CAFCNA 2007 Supporting Member
Full Member
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Posts: 24,011



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« Reply #7 on: 06/19/08 12:34 PM »

while it might idle fine, if the cats are indeed plugged, it will manifest itself under the above conditions rather quickly 
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sittin by the phone, waitin for the lord to send my calling
Question~ What are you doing in my house? Answer~ Bleeding out
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« Reply #8 on: 06/19/08 12:45 PM »

Also remember that if you document a problem while under warranty GM most likely will help with any repairs needed on the same item after your warranty runs out (within a reasonable time).
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