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Author Topic: *** Militec-1 *** †Info For You All !!!  (Read 5006 times)
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11H
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« on: 11/26/02 08:53 AM »

All,,,

Right now I'm in the process of saving funds to order a supply ... The best thing to do now is call Militec, talk yo RUSS LOGAN, and tell him Jeff Martin from AZ sent you, and that you are from the AV club/forum... Him and I have talked about this, and Members will get a break ... You just MUST talk to him, and mention me ... He promises you will be taken care of... You must telephone your order in to get a discount... Info is below!


MILITEC, Inc. *** Contact: RUSS LOGAN (Co-Owner)

http://www.militec-1.com/


11828 Pika Drive
Waldorf, MD 20602

(US ONLY) TOLL FREE: 1-877-222-5512

Phone: 1-301-893-3910  

Fax: 1-301-893-8354


11H


*** Moderators: I listed this here because it was brought up in a side topic in the "why synthetic oil is not synthetic anymore" ... I have been IM'ed a lot with questions, an it has been mentioned the post did not give enough info on how to get it, and reading the huge thread left some with nothing ... I also will say, this is a specialized product that has really "no reliable" supplier that I have a relationship with ... I have a good relationship with the Manufacturer, and that's the only way you will ever get a significant discount that I'm aware of ... Aftermarket houses, and Automotive Dealers don't stock it, much less know about it ...
« Last Edit: 11/26/02 09:02 AM by 11H » Logged
TXAVy
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« Reply #1 on: 11/27/02 12:06 AM »

Well, I found out that my home computer views the Militec site just fine, it's just my laptop that freaks out. I'm convinced they're using a font that I don't have on that computer somehow. The entire site looks fine, cept all the text is wierd boxes and symbols.

Anyway, I had a question about treatment rates. In the Synthetic Oil thread this was said...

Treat Rates for Militec-1:

Engine: 1 oz. per qt ... Add militec with a fresh oil change, document mileage, and go 15,000 from there ...
then 1/2 oz. per qt from there on.

Transmission: 1/2 oz per qt capacity... Treats for 30,000 miles or whenever you dump the tranny fluid ...

Rear diff: 2 oz... until you dump it

Trans case: 1/2 oz per qt capacity ... until you dump it

Power steering pump: 2 oz until you dump it ...

A/C re-charge ... 1/2 oz per full system WITH fresh freon re-charge only !!!

11H


While the Militec-1 website says this about treatment rates. Maybe I'm on the wrong page somewhere and there's more details elsewhere or that come with the product which have been updated?

Quote

Militec-1 Auto Application Webpage says...

Gasoline, Diesel and Propane Engines: Add 8 ounces for a 4 to 6 quart/liter engine oil crank case capacity every 15,000 miles (No mention of reducing to 1/2 oz.)

Transmissions (Manual or Automatic): Add 4 ounces every 30,000 miles (vs. 1/2 oz. per qt, probably about the same actually)

Transfer Case: Add 4 ounces every 30,000 miles (vs. 1/2 oz. per qt, probably about the same actually)

Differentials: Add 2 ounces every 30,000 miles (same)

Power Steering: Add 1 ounce every 30,000 miles (vs. 2 oz.)

Air Conditioner: Add Ĺ ounce when charging with refrigerant. (same)

Wheel Bearings: Coat metal surface with MILITEC-1 before packing with grease containing 10% to 15% MILITEC-1 or use MILITEC-1 Grease.


Just curious, and thanks again for all the info.


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11H
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« Reply #2 on: 11/27/02 02:56 AM »

TXAVy,,,

The treat rates have changed a little, and the repeat treat being half is printed on my newest product packaging... Russ Has also re-iterated this to me: "If you do oil analysis, and see there are no wear metal issues or bad results, you can extend the treat interval past 15,000 miles, 15,000 miles is just the best way to go if you don't do oil analysis... " It's a safe treat rate basically, but if you do analysis, it can be "scientifically measured in your scenario" ...

I do a little more in the power steering due to ours being a large capacity truck system... These treats they show are generic for autos, trucks, etc ... I don't think if you vary the rates a little, it's an issue... I have ammended their treat rate on the transfer case due to the fact that we don't have a simple system... We have slippage that occurs, and the case is designed to have certain torque transfer properties... Militec is so good at reducing friction, that I was leery of doing a standard treat rate... That's why I have reduced it by 50% in the Auto-Trac... I would also excercise caution in the front diff as well ... GM recommends a petroleum lube there because synthetics dissolve the pliable seal that is between the sections... I don't know if adding Militec will cause issues with the sealant GM uses... I would call Russ Logan at Militec and get his opinion after you explain the sensitive issue of the front diff... I don't treat the front because it gets such limited use, that I don't feel it needs it...

11H
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« Reply #3 on: 11/27/02 03:18 AM »

is this stuff as good as it claims?
Just curious?
Looking from reviews from other AV owners as I trust this site?!!!!!!!!!

Thanks,
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« Reply #4 on: 11/27/02 03:31 AM »

11-H, What exactly did you expereince from running the militec?
I remember someone had posted that they got better mileage using it and lowers tempatures.
they sent me a free bottle to try and i used it in the enigine oil and transmission. I have posted my driving habits probably way to many times, but for this month so far i have 3900 business miles and that does not count the hunting trip to Mississippi and around town
I have not noticed any gas mileage improvements since i have put it in. Does it take a little time? I talked to the guy at militec and he agreed that it would not lower our tempature since the engine is thermostatically controlled, but he did say it would reduce it to where the thermostat does not open as often as the engine does stay cooler............
Just wondering what you noticed out of it. I am thinking about ordering a few more bottles. Just waiting to see if anyone else noticed any improvements
zeeya
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« Reply #5 on: 11/27/02 04:17 AM »

I have started the treatments on my 2500 - initial results seem favorable - better starting and smoother idle.

I haven't had it on the dyno due to some other issues, but it did well at the track - I posted earlier.

I suspect that it will take a bit to work completely and am willing to stay the course and see.

Thanks again to 11H for the lead.
« Last Edit: 11/27/02 04:17 AM by gandolphxx » Logged

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« Reply #6 on: 11/27/02 09:36 AM »

I did the complete treatment on our beater mini-van with Militec 1 as it was due for an oil change two weeks ago.  For the last two months when the engine is cold it had a squeaky water pump (not the serpentine belt as I replaced it and the tensionor).  I was a little skeptical about adding it to the radiator but thought what the heck I had replaced the water pump at 60,000 miles and as it now has over 110,000 miles on it and is showing signs that its going out so why not.  

After a few days the squeak was gone!  Cheesy  If I get an extra 10,000 out of that water pump Iíll consider the investment in the Militec worth it as I hate to work on that shoe horned transverse engine.  veryveryangry  On our trip to New Orleans last weekend I got 27MPG averaging 75MPH.  Thatís about 1 MPG better than what I normally get.     I treated the AV the week after but havenít driven it enough to report any benefits.
« Last Edit: 11/27/02 09:37 AM by Johnny_D » Logged


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11H
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« Reply #7 on: 11/27/02 02:24 PM »

zeeya2000,,,

How much of free material did you get? You need to treat the motor with 6 oz ... If Russ gave you that much free, consider it a rarity ... He normally gives a 15ml squeezer bottle free only ... I will define "temps" a little here for you ...

The engine has many temps to consider... Coolant temps, oil temps, bearing surface temps, yada, yada ...

He's right in saying you won't notice a difference in engine coolant operating temp... Where Militec shines is in the moderate to extreme potential metal to metal contact points where a large amount of friction can occur... In a non militec treated surface, there will be more heat produced period... This will reflect a little increase in heat generated everywhere there is oil, and these surfaces... Now, under heavy loaded conditions, Militec shows it's benefits...

I want all of you to notice this paragraph, please read carefully... Taking into consideration the knowledge I have concerning lubricants, flow characteristics, and the internal combustion engine, I use militec mainly for 2 reasons:

1. There is bad contamination that happens during initial start up, and acids are not washed away as there is no oil circulating yet... So, there is bare metal getting corroded, and wearing against each other... Some say 70% of engine wear occurrs here... If so, I want the best available "dry" barrier while the contacting parts wait for oil... I think Militec DOES adhere to the surfaces, especially where there is high pressure/friction points...

2. When the engine is running, and oil is circulating, as long as you have the right weight oil, and oil is in good condition, there should NEVER be metal to metal contact... EVER!   ..........    There is ONE condition where there CAN be metal to metal contact, as a result of losing the fluid barrier... At extremely high engine loads at high RPMs ... What can happen is, The rotating assembly (Crank/Pistons/Rods/Cam) under these conditions, can apply increased pressure to these bearing surfaces to squeeze your fluid/film barrier to almost nothing... This combined with high rpms, can "throw" the remaining oil out from between these areas, and now you have metal to metal... Normally, it's a balance of centrifugal force and fluid pressure that keeps the oil in place... But when this balance is not struck anymore, hello metal on metal... So, we want a "dry" barrier, as extreme heat will be generated very quickly when this happens ... Militec, I believe is the only way to protect a motor in metal to metal contact, as rare as it may be under operation...

A US Army Jeep with a full combat complement load was drained of all motor oil, and then started, and driven 25 miles before the motor seized... This is just a Militec treated motor with no oil... Don't confuse this test with the hyped tests you see on tv like the ones by ProLong... I will elaborate... With a motor that's running, there is the fluid barrier held in place by centrifugal force, and a neutral center of gravity ... Basically, when a motor is running, and you drain the pan, there is a film of oil held in the critical ares due to these forces ... As long as a motor is really loose, and sees no major load, it should stay running, due to the film barrier... What you never saw these commercials do, was drain the oil overnight, then try to run the motors... They would never do that... The fluid barrier has not applied, and motor has not warmed up... Smiley

I'm sure some will refute this information, but it's been proven over and over ... Folks in the know about motors know this is the smoke and mirrors trick ... Engineers at Royal Purple, and folks at Militec are well aware of this, and confirmed my standing...

11H
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« Reply #8 on: 11/27/02 03:31 PM »

I too got a free sample of miltec.  I haven't used it yet and will probally use it on my firearms since I have so little.

However this brings a question to mind, who sells or who has a preoiler on their AV?

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11H
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« Reply #9 on: 11/27/02 03:56 PM »

LexLuthor,,,

Don't forget to bake all metal parts in oven on 180 degrees to get the militec to activate and treat well  

I have never heard of anyone putting a pre-oiler on a consumer vehicle... Although, I have heard of it on big rigs pretty regularly...

I was considering manufacturing my own 2 or 3 stage filtering system though... That space under the hood brace on passenger side looks lonely... But, to justify the cost of the filters I need, I would basically have to ask myself if I'm gonna have the AV for the next 10 yrs... I also might devise an inline/bypass system to filter
the tranny fluid... But, my friend at the tranny shop said he can re-build my tranny (without charging labor) with stock parts for $400, and bulletproof for $900... So, it's back to the justification question again...

11H
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« Reply #10 on: 11/28/02 01:57 AM »

I got a super prompt reply to my question to Militec about getting a free sample. I had also asked about using it on my Mtn Bike chain since the company started in lumbering/chainsaws. Smiley They said for the bike chain to use a blow dryer to warm it up and that the chemical bonding reaction takes place between 100 and 150 degrees.

Also as some history to this type of dry lube, I remember way back when they first started coming out with them. The explanation was that they were actually a long stringy molecule, with a metal looking end on one side, and a long oil looking molecule sticking out from that. The "metal" side of the molecule bonds to the metal that it's treating and leaves the oily end sticking out keeping things slick. Problem when it first came out is that shops (in Detroit) were getting it on stuff that NEEDED to stick together somewhat, and then they had no way to get it off. Needed to actually machine the surface to get rid of it. Smiley

« Last Edit: 11/28/02 02:00 AM by TXAVy » Logged

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11H
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« Reply #11 on: 11/29/02 03:55 PM »

TXAVy,,,

Maybe I didn't read it right, but did you say Militec was a "dry" lube?

11H
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« Reply #12 on: 11/30/02 12:53 AM »

I did, but I see on re-read that I didn't type what I meant. What I meant was that this lube will chemically bond to the metal and remain in place when the metal is otherwise "dry" of other lubes. That's what makes it such a good candidate for bike chains in my mind since they're out in the open, need to be relubed often, and attract dust and dirt along the way which is one of the REAL killers of bike chains.

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« Reply #13 on: 11/30/02 03:42 AM »

Hey guys,
   I don't know if this has been discussed in previous posts but I just want to caution you in using friction reducing additives (treatments) too early in an engines life. This could probably be a thread in itself and has opinions on both sides but for those who have not heard the debate...
  An engine has a break-in period the manufacturer informs it's buyers of and some think that once this 500 or 1000 mile break-in is reached that all is well and anything goes. In fact this break in period is just to keep from harming a new motor that may still have some tight fitting parts. As the motor runs, these parts wear, loosen up and begin to settle in.
  In other words, wear in the beginning of an engines life is not only good but it is required in order to end up with a good, efficient motor that doesn't burn oil.
  Unfortunately, engine wear does not stop after it reaches this efficient state but continues and then becomes destructive. The trick is to catch it once this efficient state is reached and there inlys the debate.
  Personally, I would not use any additives until around 8,000 or 10,000 miles. Having said that, I have nothing more than my opinion to back that up. I have heard of people that have had vehicles that burned oil when new then after several thousand miles they just stop. Others begin burning oil and never stop??
  However, one thing is for certain (in my opinion), if friction reducing additives are used too early in an engines life you may interupt the normal break-in and end up with an engine that is not as efficient as it could have been. When is too early.... that's debatable.
  I would like to hear others opinions so fire away!!!

Happy AV'ing!
JB  
   
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« Reply #14 on: 11/30/02 10:20 AM »

JBB3,

I had heard exactly the same thing and so I asked the folks at Militec what their experience was since they've obviously been involved in several tests. As always though, take this info and make your own decision. This is just what Militec thinks. My question and their answer are below...

Question:
Quote
Also, concerning auto applications, I'm curious if you think that Militec should be added immediately to a new vehicle or if you should run through the break-in period with normal oil before treating with Militec? It seems like the break-in period would help to get everything seated well using normal lubrication before solidifying that with Militec but I'm curious if you've had any experience there.


Answer:
Quote
On the Chevy Avalanche subject: Btw, great choice.

When MILITEC-1 is used in a brand new motor, the ring face will mate faster and more uniformly to the cylinder wall and the scuffing and scoring is practically eliminated. We recommend using MILITEC-1 in Brand New Motors, Transmissions, Transfer Cases and Differentials ; less mileage the better.

Please call us toll free @ 877-222-5512 if we may be of additional assistance.

Respectfully,

Brad P. Giordani
http://www.militec-1.com


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11H
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« Reply #15 on: 11/30/02 03:10 PM »

JBB3,,,

What constitites "break in" is a huge controversy in itself for sure... But, I will state my opinion of course...
GM uses Mobil1 as factory fill in Corvettes, and has since '96 or so... If it were bad to run "additives" straight away, so to speak, I think GM would not allow M1 as factory fill ... Also, Mobil1 recommends and says in type, that running M1 in a brand new car is fine... Synthetic lubes are pretty slick... Friction modifiers are added to them, and also conventional petro oil ... As far as break in is concerned, I think it's an over rated statement these days ... The tighter tolerances held by new manufacturing methods has resulted in some pretty consistent motors... The only breaking in parts that that actually do some breaking in are probably the rings... The rings get so hot, and vaporize any type of lubricant anyways, that it doesn't really matter what it is... It will vaporize... I think when oems built engines back 10 or 20 years ago, there may have been an oversize cam lobe, and an oversize lifter, and push rod... So to speak... If these parts had been slightly oversize, it might have not been a good idea to run the motor hard until these oversize parts wore in to each other... They may score, shard metal, or just wear together... I don't think we have the "mismatched" parts issues we once had... BUT, the 500 mile break in is probably just precautionary IF you might be the guy that had the slightly oversize crank journal, and undersized main bearing... If so, these parts will ned to be run-in slow with no load to prevent galling... So, in short, I don't think using Militec-1 or synthetic oil in a new factory motor is a problem... And, after 500 or 1,000 miles the motor has done any detrimental breaking in it might have needed to do...

The 5.3 will loosen up further at say 20,000 or better, but it SHOULD be sealing and run in within 500 or 1,000 miles...

It's your choice, do what you think is right, but I think it's no biggie...

I will add, that the ONLY additive I would EVER put in my motor would be Militec ... Never a PTFE treatment, or any of the so-called wonder additives... Now these might not be ok to put in any motor at any mileage ... Smiley

Believe me, it took me a while to believe in an additive... But, if you look at motor oils, and that they put additive packages in their oils, then what's the biggie to leave that mind open to it?

11H  
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« Reply #16 on: 09/10/03 02:18 PM »

Just ordered my Militec-1, can't wait to put it in the weed eater   or the AV either.   Grin
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« Reply #17 on: 09/11/03 09:49 AM »

I should look into this stuff for my drag motor!!!  Less friction the better.  I know when I did the Royal Purple test I lost about.05 sec on my et  maybe this stuff would be better.  I know its not the AV but felt like putting in my 2 cents.

 chevy -BD-  chevy
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« Reply #18 on: 09/13/03 12:49 PM »

I've used this stuff for over 6 years now in every damn thing that requires oil or to be oiled. From my guns, lawnmower-weedwacker-chainsaw etc (no kidding), big block motors, transmissions, differentials, transfer cases, motorcycles, my AV 2500. I haven't had any problems with the stuff. In my 493ci Olds motor it raised the idle after 15 min of pouring the stuff in. I use it in my BMW V8 engine running Royal Purple oil, 6 speed tranny & differential. It mixes well with synthetic oils fine. I mixed it in with MOTUL gearbox oil in my LSD gearbox for a Porsche I have and it cured a lot of little bullshyt problems I had with it.

This stuff works as advertised. The only product, imo, that isn't "snake oil".

Thanks Militec!
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« Reply #19 on: 09/13/03 08:15 PM »

I've used this stuff for over 6 years now in every damn thing that requires oil or to be oiled. From my guns, lawnmower-weedwacker-chainsaw etc (no kidding), big block motors, transmissions, differentials, transfer cases, motorcycles, my AV 2500. I haven't had any problems with the stuff. In my 493ci Olds motor it raised the idle after 15 min of pouring the stuff in. I use it in my BMW V8 engine running Royal Purple oil, 6 speed tranny & differential. It mixes well with synthetic oils fine. I mixed it in with MOTUL gearbox oil in my LSD gearbox for a Porsche I have and it cured a lot of little bullshyt problems I had with it.

This stuff works as advertised. The only product, imo, that isn't "snake oil".

Thanks Militec!

 Thanks for the positive post Big Block ... Ya know, I was going to way back when sell this stuff for Brad, and enter into a deal with them recently to do the same... I have had the darndest time getting over one major hurdle and being able to sell it ... The bad taste in everyone's mouth about Slick50, Duralube, and all the PTFE and resin treatments out there in the past, and the continuous mention of the oil companies and owners manuals saying, "no additives recommended.." ... LOL ... That is why I don't sell it anymore... It's too much effort to convince people otherwise, so life goes on... But what some don't understand is that 10-20% of the qt of oil you pour into your car contains soluble solids as part of the additive package, which is ok per the oil company and your owners manual, while Militec has no solids ...

Fellow Militec supporter ...

11H
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« Reply #20 on: 09/13/03 11:14 PM »

Don't despair 11H, you made me a believer - I am still using it - works like a charm in the Rat
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« Reply #21 on: 09/14/03 01:59 AM »

Oh, yeah ... You did try some ... I remember ... Now that it's been about a year, what benefits have you seen ?

11H
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« Reply #22 on: 09/14/03 07:28 AM »

Oh, yeah ... You did try some ... I remember ... Now that it's been about a year, what benefits have you seen ?

11H
I am about to order some more - The idle is very smooth, startup is clean and I am a impressed with the product. Obvilusly, I don't have a lab to analyze [or a dyno in the front yard] but it certainly has settled down the consumption issue that all BigBlocks suffer.

I think it is well worth it.
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« Reply #23 on: 09/14/03 08:44 AM »

Gandy,,,

 I put 2 oz. in my rear diff at 1500 Mi and you should see how the fluid came out at 14K ... It looked like near new with hardly anything on the magnet ...  

11H
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« Reply #24 on: 09/17/03 06:18 AM »

In all honesty, there really isn't anything to lose by trying this product at least once. Like I mentioned in my earlier post, I use the stuff in Porsche gearboxes and engines as well as BMW engines and drivetrain. Those Germans are the most anal engineers in the world and it works well with their tight fluid recommendations.

I think the best benefit of Militec that was noticeable to me and that gets the least amount of service or treatment is within the drivetrain. Gearboxes, auto tranny's, transfer cases and differentials. The long term change intervals for these components can benefit from Militec.

I'm not associated with Militec or anyone/vendor here either. This is all my personal experiences with the product. I haven't been on this specific forum for long but all I can say is I know my cars, especially European and high-performance cars.

It is my little secret weapon/protector in the European car market that I hold tightly secure.  
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2500 series AV, 4.10 LSD
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