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All Good Things..

Boar-Ral

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Joined
Feb 14, 2002
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Location
Leduc, Alberta, Canada
I have owned my 2002 Chevrolet Avalanche for nearly 18 months and have decided after much consulting and debate that it is in my best interest to sell it and purchase a different vehicle.

There are many reasons for my decision, but the two most prominent include the lack of good, responsible dealerships within reasonable driving distance and a lack of customer support from General Motors. ?Their technicians are rude, repairs have been botched, and no-one wants to be accountable for this. ?The vehicle itself is pristine and practical and one that I am proud to drive, but I cannot take the time to play '20 questions' or be presumed guilty until proven innocent every time the truck is repaired. ?It is a good example of what is wrong with many corporations today and how having a good product will not save you if your customer support is deficient.

I am now faced with the prospect of gutting my truck of all of its aftermarket components or selling it privately and hoping to recoup part of my expenses. ?I have maintained a list of upgrades and modifications to my truck and it is over 45 items. ?It will take at least one week to return the truck to stock. ?I might advertise it in the forums, but most members live in the United States and will not be interested in having to deliver a truck that far.

Now I am faced with the exact same problem that I was faced with over two years ago: what vehicle to purchase? ?In the past week, I have looked at the Ford Excursion, Ford Expedition, Lexus RX 300, Lexus RX 330, and Nissan Murano. ?These vehicles all vary greatly from one another, but I have various reasons for looking at each of them. ?At the moment, the Nissan Murano is the most appealing and most likely the one I will purchase.

There is still a possibility that this will not occur. ?I am writing to General Motors as I feel it fair to let them know what is happening and why it is happening. ?But I seriously doubt that it will have any impact, based on past experiences with them. ?Regardless of the outcome of this entire situation, I will continue to frequent the CAFCNA web page and forums and fulfill the duties appointed to me. ?After the treatment I have received from General Motors, it would be hypocritical of me to act similar to them and back out of my obligations.

The biggest thing that has me mulling over my decision is CAFCNA. ?There are no Nissan Murano clubs. ?Not even a small one. ?And I will miss being able to talk to others about my vehicle and offer and receive ideas for modifications or upgrades. ?But not even this community can outweigh the negativity that General Motors has cast over me. ?I do appreciate everything that the community has done for me and I hope that you understand the reasons for doing this.
 
Sorry to hear about your situation with GM...I'm sure many here can/will side with you and understand your anger.


I think I can speak for anyone here...if you leave...take part of us with you. You can put MODS on anything...even a murano I'm sure. Take that "MOD BUG" and carry it with you. If you leave...you will be missed. Good luck with your ordeals.


P.S.....what Mods are you selling :rolleyes:
 
justhrowit said:
Sorry to hear about your situation with GM...I'm sure many here can/will side with you and understand your anger.
It is funny that you mention that. Over the past months, as individuals brought their complaints to the table regarding General Motors, I assumed that they had either done something wrong, mistreated their truck, or simply had a bone to pick with General Motors. But last week, I had my truck in for service and was treated poorly and accused of a multitude of things. At that point, I looked back over the 18 months I owned my truck and realized that it was not just then, but almost every time I had my truck in for anything more than an oil change. It was not me. It was not the others complaining. The only common factor is General Motors and their attitude towards their customers.

justhrowit said:
I think I can speak for anyone here...if you leave...take part of us with you. ?You can put MODS on anything...even a murano I'm sure. ?Take that "MOD BUG" and carry it with you. ?If you leave...you will be missed. ?Good luck with your ordeals.
I certainly plan on taking that aspect with me. Some of the items that I wanted to upgrade on my truck are standard on the Nissan Murano, so I am ahead of the game in that regard. Other items can be upgraded similar to my truck, just in different ways.

Thanks for the well-wishes. This is not an easy part of my life. I have been unemployed for over a year, but this is a requirement; my dealership is beginning to charge for things that I feel should be under warranty and last week I was given a $500 repair bill. Obviously, this cannot continue. I have heard good things about Nissan; they are nothing like the Nissan of 10 years ago. (Even then, their vehicles might not have been pretty, but they were certainly rugged and long-lasting.)

justhrowit said:
P.S.....what Mods are you selling ?:rolleyes:
If I proceed with this, I will have a list prepared soon. I will need to look at what items can be transferred to my new vehicle and what ones cannot. Obvious items are the throttle body spacer, the air intake, the cargo basket, offroad lights, etc. They will either not work or will not look right on the vehicles I am looking at. (With a possible exception of the Ford Excursion. It might look good with a light bar.)

I am under the weather today so I am unable to go test drive today, but I will keep people updated as things progress.
 
GIVE GM HE-L!!

iT IS WELL KNOWN THAT A VEHICLE FOR MOST PEOPLE IS THE LARGEST OR SECOND LARGEST FINANCIAL COMMITMENT. If the dealership won't work with you go to the top. I own a 1993 checy silverado ext cab. In 1997, 4 year after owning it the paint started to come off my hood. I took it to the dealer which was 90 miles away to discuss my options, they tried to blame it on the wax I used. Needless to say, i blew my cool and told the dealership management where they could shove it; only after i got everyones name.
Then I specifically stated all the name in a letter of complaint to gm and sent the letter with a retrun receipt requirement. The I started calling the numbers in the owners manual until I found someone who saw my letter. after 3 months of trying to resolve the problem - gm reccommend a dealer and repainted the vehicle NO CHARGE.

I still own that truck and whenever I have a problem I let my current dealer to fix the problem with the AV or talk to gm to resolve the repair. I must admit I have had only 2 problems with my 02 av.

Godd luck, never give up and DOCUMENT ,DATE, EVERYTHING!!
YOUR FRIEND

PHIL
 
Boar-Ral,

To a smaller extent, I have felt similar to what you are describing with my new Av. The service department closest to my home treated me like I was giving a deposition for a legal proceeding when I was describing my problem to them. Fortunately, there are several Chevy dealers in my area, and I'm trying a new one out now.

I wish you the best. The Maurano caght our attention before we got our Av. I thought it was well thought-out and especially liked some of the features like the levers in the back that drop the seats without having to go around to the seat to do it...cool.

Good luck, and I'm glad you are still planning to be around here.
 
Sorry to hear about your problems, but i basically went thru the same set of problems :8:. I have incompitent dealers here where i live, and cannot even begin to fix the problems i had. :7: I wrote letters to my states attourney general(never a response to get returned), wrote and called 3 news stations(never responded back). I even went as far as calling Bob Lutz, but he basically said there is nothing they could do.
Even with my caddy, im having dealer issues. I will NOT buy a GM again anytime soon, i think i will explore the import market before i even consider a GM.
I looked at the infiniti fx35,45 and it was an amazing vehicle, and the marano is based of that, so i would say its a good choice. It seems at this point in the game , GM doesnt give 2 sh!ts about its customers, writing them IMHO will do nothing. I just bit the bullet and bought a caddy, but after my experiance with this car, A GM will not be in my garage again,
Frank
 
JUPITER1 said:
iT IS WELL KNOWN THAT A VEHICLE FOR MOST PEOPLE IS THE LARGEST OR SECOND LARGEST FINANCIAL COMMITMENT. ?If the dealership won't work with you go to the top. ?I own a 1993 checy silverado ext cab. ?In 1997, 4 year after owning it the paint started to come off my hood. ?I took it to the dealer which was 90 miles away to discuss my options, they tried to blame it on the wax I used. ?Needless to say, i blew my cool and told the dealership management where they could shove it; only after i got everyones name.
Then I specifically stated all the name in a letter of complaint to gm and sent the letter with a retrun receipt requirement. ?The I started calling the numbers in the owners manual until I found someone who saw my letter. ?after 3 months of trying to resolve the problem - gm reccommend a dealer and repainted the vehicle NO CHARGE.
I have climbed the ladder at General Motors on two occasions but I am not sure how high I got. The response was unsatisfactory, but I left it at that. I am usually an easy-going individual and not very confrontational, but General Motors is changing this aspect of me considerably. I will investigate your advice and see who else I can talk to. At the very least, I planned on contacting them anyway, to give them fair warning.

JUPITER1 said:
I still own that truck and whenever I have a problem I let my current dealer to fix the problem with the AV or talk to gm to resolve the repair. ?I must admit I have had only 2 problems with my 02 av.
Unfortunately, I have been to all of the dealerships in the area. (There are about five.) The dealership where I bought the truck seems unconcerned helping me and the other dealerships give the general impression that if you didn't buy it there, then you are a second-class customer. I complained to General Motors about one of them and they called me, but nothing ever happened.

JUPITER1 said:
Godd luck, never give up and DOCUMENT ,DATE, EVERYTHING!!
YOUR FRIEND
Fortunately, documentation is not an issue. I have a drawer full of receipts for everything from oil changes to interior cleaning. I will see what happens. Thanks again.
 
RichUF said:
To a smaller extent, I have felt similar to what you are describing with my new Av. ?The service department closest to my home treated me like I was giving a deposition for a legal proceeding when I was describing my problem to them. ?Fortunately, there are several Chevy dealers in my area, and I'm trying a new one out now.
I have never figured out why dealerships take warranty requests like a personal blow to their ego. They are vehicles and vehicles break. It just happens. They are the middleman for General Motors and should just relay my concerns. Myself, on the other hand, am the end-user and when they become verbally abusive, it is aimed at me, not someone I am forwarding a message too. Even their jokes are indicitive of their attitude and their own awareness of the situation. I was told a few months ago when they saw my Canadian flag bowtie that, "You know, that will void your warranty." It was a joke, but I responded with, "With this f*cking dealership, I wouldn't f*cking doubt it." and then walked off.

JUPITER1 said:
I wish you the best. ?The Maurano caght our attention before we got our Av. ?I thought it was well thought-out and especially liked some of the features like the levers in the back that drop the seats without having to go around to the seat to do it...cool.
There are many things I like about the Murano. The reviews I have read feel it is underpriced for what you get, and it is very comfortable and well laid out. Some things look a bit ugly, like the jutting-out stereo console, but every review says that as ugly as it is, it is so easy to reach and use that it is like second nature. I like things like that.

JUPITER1 said:
Good luck, and I'm glad you are still planning to be around here.
I couldn't leave even if I could. I have more friends here than I do in person. :)
 
Jupiter,


I've heard of a lot of people who have had paint peeling from GM cars, pre-93. This also occured on Ford. Reason...at least what I've been told. For a few years GM, and FOrd were experimenting with a paint. GM and Ford thought they could paint vehicles without putting a primer on. Well, a few years down the line it caught up with them. They stopped using it.
 
ultravorx said:
Even with my caddy, im having dealer issues. ?I will NOT buy a GM again anytime soon, i think i will explore the import market before i even consider a GM.
I had my eyes set on a Cadillac CTS for the past two days, then decided that I am not going to do General Motors a favour and purchase from them again until a serious shakeup occurs. Hearing that you are having difficulties with your Cadillac reinforces this decision.

ultravorx said:
I looked at the infiniti fx35,45 and it was an amazing vehicle, and the marano is based of that, so i would say its a good choice.
I was looking at an Infiniti FX45 but was not too keen on the body styling. That is why I decided to look more closely at the Murano. It is the same vehicle, just with not quite the same quality of leather, etc. and it has just a slightly smaller engine. The Murano is also closer to what I paid for my truck.
 
heres a little more info on my caddy problems (to help you make an informed choice >:D)

When i first bought my car, the dealer "forgot" to take care of some issues with it. Coolant leak (water crossover), window gasket, heated seat not working. After about 2 weeks i finally got a chance to bring it in. But also added that the front passenger foglight condensates, trunk leaks water, brakes squeel, dash under glove box is peeling. Once i finally got the car back, 1 week later(7 days) i noticed my lumbar was poking in my lower left side of my back, the window seal was not replaced, the peeling dash was not fixed, and my brakes still squeeled, plus the replaced foglight was loose. So i made another appointent to get this stuff fixed, plus a new rattle in the back deck. The car was in the shop for 3 days. They call me to say its ready, when i pick up the car they said parts were ordered and i would need to come back. They did fix the foglight and peeling dash. I guess with the lumbar and window gasket, parts needed to be ordered. That saturday is when sh!t really hit the fan. I noticed a HUGH dent/with scratch on my hood and front passenger side fender, it looks as if then dropped some tool on the hood and fender. And now when i hit the brake then release it, the car makes a loud metallic clunk that shakes the whole car.(to me it seems they didnt tighten the motor mounts when they replaced the water crossover). SOmetimes if i let the brake go it doesnt pop/clunk until i give it gas. It sounds horribleHere are the statistics on the car.
2001 Caddy sts
100000 Mile extended factory warranty
Certified Cadillac used car
 
This is unfortunate. After a few tries over the years, I've found a dealer close to me I trust. They've handled regular maintenance, in- and out-of-warranty repairs for me on five different vehicles, NONE of which I've purchased there. There has NEVER been a question about where the problem lies, whose 'vault' it was, etc. They just fix it. I did have several expensive out-of-warranty repairs on a pickup and took that to 'higher levels' and that was a bit painful, but the end result was satsifaction.

The dealer really really does matter. I really lucked out because I don't even have a salesman at this dealer to leverage.

Before taking the plunge with another brand, you might want to try to ask around for folks owning that brand to see what dealers they trust, and buy there.

Good luck!
 
:p
I agree with you guys totally on the bad service and just plain p@ss poor customer service from GM. In fact it got so bad that I swore that I would never own another GM. If it wasn't for their trucks I would seriously drop them like a dress on prom night.
They really need to wake up and realize that they are now asking in the $40K range for vehicle and you can go and pick up a BMW, some Mercedes, Lexus, and several other luxury vehicles that do offer outstanding customer service.
I still remember going in with my buddy to the dealer to drop off his new Lexus SUV and seeing how he was treated....I just couldn't believe how nice it was, and how far they went out of their way to ensure that he was completely comfortable and happy.
That is the way it should be. Most folks are now financing these vehicles for 5+ years and need the follow up service to make it feel worth while. It's not just the sale, it's the service and dealings after the sale that will create return business. Too bad most companies don't care about that any more.
It isn't just some car companies it is cell phone companies, telephone services, and numerous other types.
The best to combat this is with the almighty wallet. We as consumers need to be willing to FIRE these companies and put our wallets back in our pockets if something isn't going right. This is the only way that things will change.
Good luck with selling your truck and I hope that you find a company that takes good care of you.
 
Boar
Hop in an loaded Aztek
they are pretty unique in all aspects even looks

and we have a 3+ fan clubs and rallies like the AV club
 
Capecruis8der said:
Boar
Hop in an loaded Aztek
they are pretty unique in all aspects even looks

and we have a 3+ fan clubs and rallies like the AV club
I considered the Aztek a lot. :)

In the end, I am taking the 'wait and see' approach. Dad called General Motors - he is much better at confrontation than I am - and they are not looking into my claims and are supposed to call me within one week. In the meantime, I am going to assume things will turn around and improve, and I am looking towards more modifications for the truck. :)
 
Wow - I hope that things can be fixed to your satisfaction. Unfortunately once that bad feeling starts it is hard to get rid of it. My dealer has been OK so far but they have not had to do anything difficult. The level of service - as far as the way the customer is treated - is much below some of the other marques that I have owned. For example the Volvo dealer I used to go to was amazing in how well they treated you and what they gave you in little perqs (free state inspections, free oil changes, etc) to keep your business.

I plan on keeping my truck for at least 5-6 years and hope I don't suffer buyer's remorse somewhere down the road because of service.

Oh, if you decide to get something else - I hope all your computer stuff fits into the next vehicle! ;D
 
Tomorrow I take possession of a 2004 Ford Excursion Limited. I really love my Avalanche but it continues to be in the shop for things that simply should not be breaking. The dealership shows no interest in resolving these matters in any way other than me tossing more money into repairs. We do not have a lemon law here so that is not an option, either.

I will continue to frequent the forums and I am still on good terms with some employees at my dealership and other dealerships and am attempting to spread the word about CAFCNA. It is a truck I will always enjoy and I will continue to promote it and CAFCNA. My position as Canadian and Alaskan Coordinator still exists for another 18 months. (I believe it is a two-year position.) I will continue to do my best in this position.

I will be selling my Avalanche if anyone is interested, but with its history, I am not sure if anyone will be interested in it.

Fortunately, I found a Ford Excursion forum, so I have some sort of place like this to look for advice. I find that a lot of ideas here and there are also interchangable, so that helps a lot.

I have some second-guessing, but it is too late for that. I love my Avalanche, but all good things must end.
 
Boar-Ral said:
Tomorrow I take possession of a 2004 Ford Excursion Limited. I really love my Avalanche but it continues to be in the shop for things that simply should not be breaking. The dealership shows no interest in resolving these matters in any way other than me tossing more money into repairs. We do not have a lemon law here so that is not an option, either.

I will continue to frequent the forums and I am still on good terms with some employees at my dealership and other dealerships and am attempting to spread the word about CAFCNA. It is a truck I will always enjoy and I will continue to promote it and CAFCNA. My position as Canadian and Alaskan Coordinator still exists for another 18 months. (I believe it is a two-year position.) I will continue to do my best in this position.

I will be selling my Avalanche if anyone is interested, but with its history, I am not sure if anyone will be interested in it.

Fortunately, I found a Ford Excursion forum, so I have some sort of place like this to look for advice. I find that a lot of ideas here and there are also interchangable, so that helps a lot.

I have some second-guessing, but it is too late for that. I love my Avalanche, but all good things must end.

VEry sad to hear.......wahhhhhhh...

Good luck
 
It is a shame that you are stuck with a Chevy dealer like that! You could get a lemon in any vehicle and service starts with the dealer. If the dealer tells GM one thing and you tell them something else it does seem like they pay more attention to the dealer and ignore you. Luckily I have a great dealer that will work with me on anything (at least so far). I wish you good luck with you new vehicle!

Butch
 
Z66 BUTCH said:
It is a shame that you are stuck with a Chevy dealer like that! You could get a lemon in any vehicle and service starts with the dealer. If the dealer tells GM one thing and you tell them something else it does seem like they pay more attention to the dealer and ignore you. Luckily I have a great dealer that will work with me on anything (at least so far). I wish you good luck with you new vehicle!
Thank you for your encouragement. Once I move in a few years and have access to different dealerships, I will probably purchase another GM product. I do like them, I just wish for a dealership that will acknowledge it when they are faced with a specific vehicle that has a higher-than-average number of problems, like mine. It definitely feels weird purchasing a Ford. Fortunately, it is not a Dodge. :)
 
Boar-Ral said:
Tomorrow I take possession of a 2004 Ford Excursion Limited. I really love my Avalanche but it continues to be in the shop for things that simply should not be breaking. The dealership shows no interest in resolving these matters in any way other than me tossing more money into repairs. We do not have a lemon law here so that is not an option, either.

I will continue to frequent the forums and I am still on good terms with some employees at my dealership and other dealerships and am attempting to spread the word about CAFCNA. It is a truck I will always enjoy and I will continue to promote it and CAFCNA. My position as Canadian and Alaskan Coordinator still exists for another 18 months. (I believe it is a two-year position.) I will continue to do my best in this position.

I will be selling my Avalanche if anyone is interested, but with its history, I am not sure if anyone will be interested in it.

Fortunately, I found a Ford Excursion forum, so I have some sort of place like this to look for advice. I find that a lot of ideas here and there are also interchangable, so that helps a lot.

I have some second-guessing, but it is too late for that. I love my Avalanche, but all good things must end.

I hope you enjoy the Excursion. I also hope you get better support since 2004 is supposed to be the last year for the Excursion. :E:
 
flynhigh said:
I hope you enjoy the Excursion. I also hope you get better support since 2004 is supposed to be the last year for the Excursion. :E:
Everything seems to be well so far. I watched the service department there for a couple days in order to get an idea of how things were, quality-wise. That helped me decide on the vehicle and the dealership. :)
 
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