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More Air = More Power?

M

MrFish

Charter Member
Full Member
Joined
Jan 24, 2002
Messages
390
Location
Redmond, WA
So, everyone's installing TBS's, FIPK's, UPD's, etc. It appears that more airflow = more power. For those of us with UPD's or stock airboxes, how about removing the foam bumper/filters affixed to the passenger side of the airbox. I'm assuming that this is where the air gets into the box before being filtered. If this foam was removed, wouldn't even MORE air get in? Of course, if the main bottleneck is the filter itself, this won't do squat.

Thoughts?
 
If you remove the foam, you defeat the main claim of the UPD that it allows only outside air to come in - probably also get a nice rattle on bumpy side streets.

My $.02 ;D
 
Unless you have a super charger or turbo charger, then an N/A motor can only take so much air in . You want the coldest air and smoothest flowing air as possible into the motor..The less resistance= the less the engine has to work to suck air into it.This = more power, etc. etc. Colder air is denser and also =more air=more power. :) Its kinda like you sucking beer through a cocktail straw or just pooring it down ,smooth and easy.. You would have to work pretty hard to get that beer through a small straw..:)

The foam peices you see are not filters, they are open in the middle and only work as a gasket between the air box and fender well..

Thats good thinking though. It always help to look for more power and easy mods. They are there to be found.

 
I agree with Redhawk 98%. ;D

I haven't looked so I don't know, but unless there are holes in the fender where the "holes" in the foam line up (for free-er flowing air), that does mean that the engine has to suck that much harder to get the air through the foam. If there are holes in the fender and that is where the air comes in, great. If it has to suck it through the foam... well, think of the cocktail straw.

One "free" mod that is done on a lot (if you are NOT going with a cone style filter), is to shed "half" of the airbox, or prop it open. I haven't looked at our airbox yet to see how it can be done, but airboxes are usually two parts. Top and bottom. Normally the air moves into the box and UP through the filter into the TOP portion, which is a tube eventually ending at the TB. Thus air has to get inside this box first, which means sucking through a "hole" in the box. The idea of a cone filter is to eliminate the hole and just breath easy (think: breathing through a straw versus normally).

So... another option is to crack open the box and use hardware of somekind to keep the filter FIRMLY SEALED against the top. Either create a gap between the top and bottom, thus making the "hole" bigger (easier breathing), or remove the bottom totally (same premise as the cone).

I don't know if people saw my post in another thread about the FIPK. The FIPK is a crappy deal... period. You can get the same thing for 1/4 the price by buying the appropriate sized cone filter and mounting it to your existing intake pipe (i.e., take the box off and mount the cone). Don't like the OEM intake pipe? You can easily make your own for a fraction of the cost and route the filter anywhere.

Oh yeah, don't be too concerned about the engine bay heating up your intake charge (part of the FIPK gives you a "heat shield"). Two things: A) your TB and the intake pipe going to the TB sit right behind the radiator and on top of the engine. This will heat your intake charge regardless of the heat shield thingy. 2) Your TB and intake manifold have coolant passages in them. HOT coolant (doesn't that sound funny? ;D) flows through these keeping the intake hot.

Anyhoo... shiz-nit... anybody notice my posts are always long as <insert unoffensive adjective here>? ;)

Nate
 
;DOK since someone brought that up why not cut a 8" by 8" hole in the front of the airbox and then all the air that comes through the headlight system which should be cool as long as you are moving should boost the amount of air coming in.........have thought about it many times , but the kahoonas keep getting stuck in my throat making it hard to swallow..........would this do anything? until i switched over to one of the fipk systems......
zeeya
 
zeeya - did you read my response on the fipk? Just buy a cone filter for $50 and save over $150 by using the OEM intake pipe. Also by doing this you'll use the OEM intake resonators and thus won't experience the new *noise* others experience. Just my opinion, but the fipk and others like it are a complete rip off. You are paying mostly for a pipe that you could easily fabricate yourself. I have done this on another car for $9.

If you are asking about a "Ram Air" type of system, it would likely not be worth it. You'd probably need a larger airbox to get anything out of it and you need it sealed (no 8x8 holes). Plus you'd need the entire air-pick up track sealed. The shorter and straighter the track, the better this "ram air" thing works. And even then it doesn't give enough hp to make it worth it, IMO.

Nate
 
Can someone please tell me what TBS's, FIPK's, UPD's all mean? Isee these acronyms being used a lot around here and have absolutely no idea what they mean? Now I feel stupid. But hey, thanks a lot!
 
FIPK = Fuel Injected Performance Kit - a replacement for the stock air filter / induction tube to the throttle where many have also installed a TBS = Throttle Body Spacer. Reference pages to all of these below.

K&N
UPD
TBS
Volant

Scan these sites and you will be an expert ;D



 
nate said:
zeeya - did you read my response on the fipk? ?Just buy a cone filter for $50 and save over $150 by using the OEM intake pipe. ?Also by doing this you'll use the OEM intake resonators and thus won't experience the new *noise* others experience. ?Just my opinion, but the fipk and others like it are a complete rip off. ?You are paying mostly for a pipe that you could easily fabricate yourself. ?I have done this on another car for $9.

Nate
Click to expand...

I actually did this on Friday night. I took out the stock airbox, and attached a cone filter to the "scrunchy type material" at the end of oem intake pipe. I also removed the metal plate that's below the oem intake. This will help provide more cool air coming in from the bottom of the truck.

Additionally, I'm considering to remove the wire mesh from inside the oem intake, as well as dremeling down the oem intake pipe so that the air takes a more direct path.

It may not look as good, but it does the same job as your $280. FIPK kit. ;D

If someone can host the images for me, I'll be glad to take pictures and email them to you.

-LEEDER
 
Leeder - THANK YOU!!! It pains me to see my Avalanche brethen poor hard earned dollars out for a silly plastic tube when they already own a silly plastic tube. ;D

You might post where you got the cone, what size/part # for everyone else. There are plenty of options for sure and all anybody needs to do is make some measurements and then go to K&N's site and find a cone and record the part #. Then use your favorite search engine to find that part # at the lowest price.

Regarding removing the lower plate for cooler air. Again, I haven't taken much of a look under the hood yet so I am not sure, but be careful that by removing it you don't expose the cone to water-splash-spray. (damages filter and even worse if any amount of water makes it past the TB). hee hee - today at lunch there was an enormous puddle in the parking lot that I drove through at speed. Created huge walls of water to each side of the truck. Also after there was a ton of smoke coming up from the bottom of the truck. =) Just make sure the filter isn't exposed to that!! Also note that while it may provide some additional cooling that it won't make much of a difference performance wise. The intake charge gets heated up further down the pipe (see my original post in this thread).

Nate
 
All I did was go to a local performance shop, and bought a cone air filter. I got the one made by Air Raid for $30.00. I'm not sure about the model #, but the diameter is about 5". Hope this helps! ;D

Also, your right about the metal plate. I live in Miami, and there are times when we do get some heavy rain. A friend of mine who is a tech for gm did it to his silveraldo, a couple of years ago...and no problems thus far. I might decide to put it back on though...
 
I am confused about all of this. If an engine can "suck" enough air to run 100 mph, (or whatever the limiter lets it run), and rev to 6000 RPM, wouldn't you think the engine would easily be getting all the air it can use at 60 mph and loafing along at under 2000 RPM? I can see how reduced intake restriction can help on the track when you are running wide-open-throttle (WOT), but am skeptical that much difference will be noticed in normal driving.
Many modifications make the vehicle "feel faster" due to the increased noise making it "sound faster" (which is not necesarily a bad thing, nothing sound better than a V-8 at full howl) but any real performance or mileage gains will probably be minimal or non-existant.
This isn't to say the K&N filters, etc., are not good products. Better filtration, re-usable filter, less air restriction, great sound, are all good things, just don't expect a >300 dollar modification to change a 5.3 litre into an 8.1. Serious performance modifications cost serious dollars, and a gain in one area USUALLY means a loss somewhere else. An increase in top-end speed often means a loss in low speed torque. An increase in horsepower often means a decrease in reliability/longevity. That is why race cars have an adjustable boost. They know that the higher they boost the engine, the shorter the life. They are always walking the line between having enough power to win, and having the engine hold together long enough to finish. These relatively inexpensive mods are fine, as far as they go, just don't expect a miracle for a couple of hundred bucks!
The old hot-rodder adage is still true -
"Speed = Money, how fast can you afford to go?"
Keep on Avalanching! ???
 
Very True Big_Don, Everything you said I experienced with my Yamaha Warrior. I put about $1500 worth of mods into it and realized that all I did was boost acceleration with a huge loss of top end speed. When it comes to racing quads you want the acceleration. So I guess the loss of top end was not an issue. I imagine you would experience the same with Cars and Trucks when the mods are similar.
 
You have a very good point....but somehow even if all I can achieve is better gas milage...and a meaner sounding rig...ohhh well what the heck....

I know I'll never see a 1/4 mile track down in Englishtown.. :(
 
Its true that most Mods show there best above 4000 R.P.M., but some do help the bottom end somewhat..., Especially the Whipple Charger.., get to 1000 R.P.M.., and Your already making Power, and Torque., and You can always use that.., I need more passing Power Excuse.., Laughs.. Hey NJAV...., ill be down in Englishtown in early May.., helping My Buddy who runs a D/Atered Corvette, at the National Event.., if You go maybe we'll bump into each other......
 
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