• If you currently own, previously owned or want to own an Avalanche, we welcome you to become a member today. Membership is FREE, register now!

Torque Management Disabler

A

avalanche_crazy

Full Member
Joined
Mar 9, 2003
Messages
42
Location
Charlotte NC
I have an HPIII, and still I am affected by torque management. My local pro shop recommends a Pro street programmer, supposedly it has more settings and can completely eliminate torque mangement. The thing that burns me is that I bought my HPII from them two weeks ago! :mad:You think they could have told me this before. Anyone had any experience with this programmer or is my parts guy trying to fleece me. THANKS!
 
ever try to spin your tires on dry pavement from a dead stop? The reason you [probably] can't is TM, assuming that the 5.3 has enough torque to do it :cautious:

At least I think that's what it is, or what it keeps you from doing anyway.
 
RichUF,

That makes sense now....You know that really ticks me off about our AV. Not that I would go nutts doing it, but it sure would be nice to hear those tires squel.
 
It hasn't bothered me, and I'd hope that there are some benefits due to all of this engineering and computer programming (like maybe wet road safety?...don't know if that's even what it's for). But I'd be ticked too I guess if I wanted to override it and couldn't.
 
i've heard that the predator programmer does a great job removing TM. ?check out some of their posts and PM a few folks that have purchased it...
 
Hmmmm...first I have heard of the 2003 having
torque mgmt / traction control.

I have a 2003 Z71 and whenever the pavement
is wet and I start from a stop sign and turn
left or right, the locker kicks in and both
tires light up. With barely any gas being
applied...

Should I have torque mgmt on my 2003 Z71?

Emery
 
As far as I know all the Av's have TM, it is GM's way of limiting warranty claims. I to have a rear locker, and I can spin them when it is wet, but when it is dry, nothin.. :(
 
The Family Man said:
I don't think my base model 03 AVI has it.
Click to expand...

I think all of the AV's have them. It sure got me yesterday when I was trying to tackle a steep hill in 4hi. I had to put it in tow haul mode and 4lo 2nd gear to get up it.
 
Torque management and Abuse prevention is built into the powertrain control module. It drops out at about 10mph so unless you are trying to spin the tires you won't know it's there. It monitors sensors such as throttle position, vehicle speed, wheel speed, etc. and tries to prevent the sudden application of excessive power. It does suck.

kw
 
OK, we have established that all AV's have TM, whether you know it or not ;). Now back to the original question, Pro street performance has a programmer known as the Proflash, it has the charecteristics of the HPIII, more options, and the tech guy says it 100% disables TM at WOT. He said you can " smoke those tires till they blow", they offer a 30 day satisfaction gaurantee, so if you don't blow your tires they will take it back! ;D
 
OK, we have established that all AV's have TM, whether you know it or not . Now back to the original question, Pro street performance has a programmer known as the Proflash, it has the charecteristics of the HPIII, more options, and the tech guy says it 100% disables TM at WOT. He said you can " smoke those tires till they blow", they offer a 30 day satisfaction gaurantee, so if you don't blow your tires they will take it back!
Click to expand...

Be really careful with "new and improved programmers".
It's a pretty sticky situation when they don't upload/download/hang ... Most times if the unit hangs during an up/download, the PCM needs re-flashing ... There have been 2 recent big hitters introduce new programmers since Hypertech.... The Superchips unit (which also boasted of removing most of the TM) ruined the software on many guy's av's and they needed to be re-flashed... The Diablo is a great unit, but they have had some transmission shifting calibration issues... Personally, I would stick with a company that can provide a re-flash if their unit misbehaves... I have had 4 or 5 HPP3's and one Diablo, and I came back to the HPP3 ... It just doesn't do anything wrong... It's reliable, and as far as shifting firmness, and shift points, it has the best feel so far IMHO ... Plus, it allows 3 different power tuning levels (stock, 87, and 93) ... The Diablo is 93 only ... Among other things ... Just do your research, and understand that designing a flawless programmer takes some time ... And experience ... Interfacing with OBDII and manipulating it can be a hard thing to do in a mass produced programmer ... >:D

11H
 
If you are truly at the "line" the last thing you want to do is spin your tires - if you want to just wear down the tires try a very very very small stripe of Amorall around the tread and burnout enough to wear it off before you kill yourself and others around you. :rolleyes:

We had a post on here about a guy who totaled his vehicle by applying Amorall to his tires to make them look nice, tread and all. >:D
 
7of7 said:
Pardon the 'dumb' question, but, what are the benefits of having t/m disabled?
Click to expand...

Not dumb at all. The torque management is built in to protect the drivetrain from "abusive maneouvers" like rocking the truck, drag racing and leaving twenty feet of rubber on the road at stop signs. It kicks in primarily at WOT and under certain other conditions which are beyond this post.

1. If your truck is a daily driver, and you want it to last 100,000 miles with little or no maintenance and complete warranty protection for the drivetrain, stop here and go to another post.

2. If you just want to leave rubber on the street and still want the advantages of #1 above, stop here and go no further.

3. If you drag race, believe that transmissions should be rebuilt ocassionally and don't expect warranties to be useful then you may want to consider removing the torque management to get the max launch from your truck. It requires re-programming of the PCM and requires a knowledgeable person to do it properly - most, if not all of the handheld tuners will not remove it, notwithstanding their advertising.

I would recommend Westers Garage or LS1Edit as the best choices.

WARNING - if you remove the torque management and it is discovered after they tow your dead truck and tranny in you will have NO warranty coverage on the engine or drivetrain - and it is hard to set it back to stock when it is dead. >:D
 
I happened to notice this issue a few times. My truck gains a lot of torgue after 20 mph or so. For my purposes it's fine with me that I can't spin the tires off the line. Trust me when I tell you that if I could spin my tires from a dead stop I would be doing it a lot. :2:
 
Powersurge said:
I happened to notice this issue a few times. My truck gains a lot of torgue after 20 mph or so. For my purposes it's fine with me that I can't spin the tires off the line. Trust me when I tell you that if I could spin my tires from a dead stop I would be doing it a lot. ?:2:
Click to expand...

This sounds like a different issue off the top - called back pressure - I don't know if you have changed the exhaust system but that can dramatically effect low end torque, especially if you have duals.
 
Actually I don't have the duels yet. The Borla's will be bought in the next couple of weeks. Maybe I exagerated a bit my last post but the power I get off the line is not the same as the power I get at 30 MPH. I'm using stock exhaust with a Throttle Body spacer as my only mod. :6: At a stop and even a 10 mph roll I don't get a feeling of power that I get at 30.

When I heard about this Torque Management system I figured that this might be it. The power loss is not extremely noticable. If a person didn't know the vehicle like we all do they would insist it was the same at all the speeds mentioned above
 
IMHO ... I can't speak for all trucks; only mine... A direct reflection of TM is a QUICK application of Timing Retard and "apparently" a reduction in fuel delivery ... I don't know if there is any mysterious wizardry GM has at their disposal to go beyond these 2 things... But hey, I'm just a pee-on ...

One would think that EFILive would have a fast enough read rate... to watch the retard PDI and the STFT PDI ...(I think if you're monitoring 2 PDI's it's 30 times a second)

I have done this on the av with the oem programming and the only TM I was able to induce was loading the driveline to over 1500 RPM (stand still) and mashing it with an IAT over 90 Degrees F or so ... This resulted in no change in STFT but about a 4 or 5 degree retard for a couple seconds...

Furthermore, I was able to see up to a 10 degree retard right before the trans shifted during hard acceleration and highway passing runs ... This happened most of the time at throttle positions over about 50% under varying loads...

My conclusion? ... With my vehicle only as a tester with EFILive that updates the 2 PDI's I monitored at roughly 30 times a second, I personally think TM is over-glorified ... The only time, like I said that I witnessed the retard was under the 2 conditions I mentioned above ... I NEVER saw fuel get pulled back ... At least through monitoring the STFT's ... O2 readings are all over the place, but when I graphed even all three, the O2 graph was stable even when timing was pulled back... I don't think O2 readings would have anything to contribute to TM ... IMHO

Then why the lagging and doggieness that some complain about in the 1500? ... I think it's just heavy, and has a little V8 with 327 cubes of displacement ... The lag that some may be feeling off the line "could" be TM like we think, but remember, I had to really abuse the truck to get it to show up in EFILive ... Also, the lag we might be experiencing when quickly mashing it from a stop is the fact that the motor has not built much vaccum, (at 500 rpm idle) and the throttle is now wide open; and we now want to move a 3 ton truck NOW ... I think it's a lag in the motor's response more than anything ... IMHO

I can't speak for the 2500 avalanche, as I have only tinkered with my 1500 Av ...

... Something to add to our bowl of TM rice ...

11H
 
It has been my experience and from reading that TM is only really aggressive at what is defined as WOT - there are protective measures around the shift points for the 4L60E - they are not as pronounced in the 4L85E.

It is my read that there are three tables that need to be adjusted to remove it in the 8.1L and the Vette case - it is probably different in the LS1 models. That ignores the Tow/Haul case since it is not expected that TM would be a problem in that mode.
 
That ignores the Tow/Haul case since it is not expected that TM would be a problem in that mode.
Click to expand...

So in saying this, one would think if they had a Diablo Predator (I have another on the way) that they could use the Tow/Haul tune feature and through fully tuning the Tow/Haul mode that we would in essence "not" have torque management ?

The Diablo lets you tune 2 modes... One full mode in T/H and another in standard (non-T/H) ... Kinda like turning the T/H button into P/H ... (Performance Haul) ... LOL

Thoughts gandolphxx?

11H
 
11H said:
So in saying this, one would think if they had a Diablo Predator (I have another on the way) that they could use the Tow/Haul tune feature and through fully tuning the Tow/Haul mode that we would in essence "not" have torque management ?

The Diablo lets you tune 2 modes... One full mode in T/H and another in standard (non-T/H) ... Kinda like turning the T/H button into P/H ... (Performance Haul) ... LOL

Thoughts gandolphxx?

11H
Click to expand...

Thats interesting - I personally prefer having T/H protected and will leave it that way - while I may not seem concerned about my transmission, I am.

I guess the flip side would be to program the T/H for kicks and use that to impress folks at the stop light >:D
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top