bonesaw said:
Well, I said I would post more comments later.? So, as promised:
Thank you for your comments. As a comittee member, I am genuinely interested in your opinions.
Hopefully, the powers that be will accept this criticism, so you all can understand my decision.? Please keep in mind that I didn?t just throw this up here.? I originally typed this the night I got home from Niagara Falls and saved it on the computer so I could think about it, re-read it, revise it, and think about it some more, and I waited until now to post it (and for the record, I was leaning toward not posting this at all).? I've never even recieved a TOS violation for anything.? And I'm sure that numerous other members can attest that I'm one of the most "easy-to-get-along-with" people on this forum.
I?ve never said anything too bad, or insulting, or antagonizing on here before tonight.? Most people who know me, know that I am one of -- if not the -- most laid back person in the world. I know I am not alone in having these same opinions regarding this GTG, but I'm apparently the only one PO'd enough about it to post it here.
That is a pretty strongly worded introduction for what appears to be valid and constructive comments. As I started to read this, my blood pressure spiked, as I was bracing for an emotional diatribe. I really don't see this as antagonizing (your words) or anything for which you need to fear retribution.
1 - Registration cost more this year yet there were less things that we got for it.? I have my own thoughts but I?m not going into this can of worms anymore than that.
This is the one statement you make that I hope I am taking the wrong way. It sounds like you are making accusations here. While I am a member of the committee, I had no association with the finances. My understanding is that last year, we lost a significant amount of money on the event, which was covered by several committee members (including myself.) It would've been easy to keep some (actually most) of the money that was earmarked for the Tender Wishes charitable donation, but we never considered that an option. With the experience learned from last year, we adjusted prices this year, and have come close to breaking even this time. (This does not include paying back personal debts from last year, I consider them a write-off.)
I understand that I am not entirely impartial, but I assure you I have no connection with the financial portion of the event (other than incurring some unreimbursed personal expenses.) If you have any concerns about the finances, I would really like to talk about it privately.
2 - The hotel was way less than accommodating for us (by ?us? I mean everyone that gave that place our business/money).? I?m not talking a little less than accommodating, I?m talking ?how do we keep them from coming back again? type of treatment.? An added bonus was that the committee didn?t appear to even care.
You are right, the hotel was less than accomdating. What were they thinking by putting two large groups in the same courtyard? It does appear that they didn't have the guts to tell us "don't come back" and instead decided to make life difficult for us.
But there are two things I can assure you about this: the committee did care and was very upset about this, and we will absolutely not go back to that hotel again.
Suggestion for next year:? Make it VERY clear to the hotel (whether it is the same one or a different one) what our requirements/wants/needs are.? Make sure they understand this and that you have something in writing with the agreed upon group rates as to what "extras" a group our size will be getting (ie: The entire group being together. No other large groups that weekend, reserved parking, etc.)
We are already looking at a new hotel. One that is larger, has proper conference facilities, and is set up for handling large groups. Not a tourist stop, like the last hotel, but one that is set up for handling larger corporate and special event meetings. All of your suggestions are already part of the negotiations.
3 - The location for the Saturday gala was horrible.? We really weren?t any closer to the trucks than we were last year, which is what I was told was the main reason the location was changed.? At least last year we got to park on pavement, and had real bathrooms (the corner of the field behind my truck seemed to be the popular alternative to using those nasty porta-poopers).? My nose and eyes were burning for the rest of the weekend and the whole trip home.? All the stuff that got kicked up from us driving through that field no doubt had a lot to do with it, and I know I?m not alone in this one.
I have already addressed this in another post shortly after the event. In short, the committee toured the site in the dead of winter. We could basically walk the road that passed in front of the small office building, and look out at the field covered in a thick blanket of snow. We were told several things about the site that did not turn out to be true. When the committee arrived on site, we were appalled by the actual state of things. We made some last minute changes for damage control, but there were limits to what we could accomplish at that time.
Suggestion:? Have it at the same place as AVs Cruise Niagara 1 or another similar place.? Just not in the middle of a freshly mown hayfield.? Just imagine what the results would have been if there had been any heavy rainstorms that week.
You bring up a very good point, we were
extremely lucky with the weather. It could've been a nightmare of a mud quagmire. Again, we will not go back there again, and the main event will be held at someplace equivalent or better than last year. It will
not be in a field. There
will be paved parking and shelter, and it might even be indoors. At the time we made the arrangements, we thought that a private area away from the public, and with the trucks in clear view of the participants, would be beneficial. While the intent ws good, the execution was obviously flawed.
4 - No surprise, the food, as well, was horrible.? My 15 freaking dollar Sausage dog was about like eating a leather sock filled with God only knows what.? Not much worse than last year?s, just more expensive.? At least last year a drink was included with the meal instead of $1.25 for soda (That?s IF you bought 4.? I just wanted 1, so I had to pay TWO FREAKIN? DOLLARS, for 1 can of soda that wasn't really that cold)
I thought the chicken I had was better than my meal last year. (Of course, I was one of the last to be served last year, and I think I got the dregs at the bottom of the barrel.) I didn't try the sausage, so I have no experience there. While the drinks were expensive, at least there was more variety than last year, and there were greater quantities. (I never did get anything to drink last year, as they had run out.) Again, we relied on the representations made by the caterer, who was also the property owner. You can be sure we will never trust anyone that much again.
Suggestion for next year:? TAILGATING!!! I know the food we cooked on karen's little grill by my truck was far superior than what was provided to us by the caterer and was much cheaper ($15.00 could have fed 4-5 people)
That is a very good suggestion. We will take it to heart, investigating that and other options.
5 - The band was horrible. As one member (who will remain anonymous) said when they pulled in and heard it:? ?Oh, God, are they doing karaoke?? All I could say back was, ?Nope, that?s the band?
Suggestion:? Hire a DJ instead, make sure they will play a wide variety of music instead of "what's in your dad's LP collection"
We did a DJ last year, and got even more complaints. (Of course, last year's DJ was a last minute engagement made the night before when the radio personality who was supposed to appear, backed out.)
This is a difficult situation, as people's musical tastes vary widely. There is no way to make everybody happy. We will carefully consider our options next time.
6 - Because of two individuals - Dragonslayer and whitethunder.? ?One bad apple ruins the whole barrel. . . ?? well, this barrel happened to have two.? Something should have been done to check their attitudes on Friday night instead of waiting.? Having either of them around brings discredit upon this event and this organization.? Not to mention the safety aspect of it (I nearly got run over by one of them because of them doing a burnout in a crowded parking lot) As several members said, "is this really the type of image that we want others to see"
Suggestion:? BAN THEM BOTH!!!? From the NF GTG and from here.? We (those of us that were doing the complaining) were told this would be done within 2 weeks.? Apparently the committee (and the moderators on it) change their minds and/or neglected to do what was promised would happen to them.? Amazing how members that speak their mind get banned, but those that endager the safety of other members are allowed to stay.
This was discussed at great length by the planning committee and by site management. While there are steps that the planning committee can take to prevent a repeat of these actions, there is little that the online club can do. People can be banned for their online behavior which is contrary to the terms of service. These two people did nothing online that is grounds for banishment. They did things in person, but there is nothing in the terms of service that controls people's behavior in real life.
Rules do need to be put in place to prevent a recurrance of such actions, and allow appropriate consequences to actions, both online and in person. It's a shame that some people can't always act appropriately, and that such rules are needed.
Again, I'd like to point out that this is being posted so that next year's event can be better for the attendees, whether I'm one of them or not.
I do hope you reconsider, as it was a pleasure to have you attend both events in the past. If you choose not to attend, I will be dissapointed, but I will understand. After this past event, I was also upset, and questioned my own participation in the future. Instead, I have decided to stay on, and work to improve things.
All I can say at this point is that I truly appreciate your comments. Many things didn't go well at this event, and the committee is aware of them, and sorry for them. We made mistakes last year, and we made different mistakes this year. Rest assured that we will not make those same mistakes again. Undoubtably, we will make new mistakes, and hopefully they will be minor.
This year, we had a planning committee that was about half the size of last year. While there was less new ground to break, and we did have some experience, there was still more work to do per person that last year. Early on, we found a caterer who could help with a lot of the little details that overloaded us in the past. Our biggest mistake was to place too much faith in him and not check and recheck every detail.
With luck, we will get more people to sign up for the planning committee (we already have a couple of fresh faces) and we will be able to scruitinize the myriad details that are required to pull off a successful and enjoyable event. If there is anybody (including yourself) who would like to work with the committee to make next year's event a resonding success, please feel free to contact either myself or MrBill.
-- SS
) tastes like rancid spaghetti O?s. Something tells me that Jack agrees with me.
